The Roster Thread, Summer 2024

[Jacob582]

Skinner has a sharp bipolar division of his games within a season. He is either engaged during a game (his chirping shows this), or he is disinterested in executing the extra steps needed to score.

He won't respond well to benching. He'll just shut down.

 

[Archie Lee]

I'll take one Joshua, one Trenin and one Duhaime please and thank you

I went to capfriendly, extended our RFA's at the projected amounts from that spreadsheet and then signed Joshua, Trenin and Duhaime at the projected amounts plus a 15% Sabre tax (conservative I think). I then promoted Levi, Johnson and Rousek to back-up roles to round out the 23 player roster. It takes us to within $200k of the cap ceiling.

Would be nice, though it's really just changing the bottom 6.

What I think will happen:

- We will trade Joker for a bottom-6 centre. Last year's rumours of us being in on Cates or Laughton from the Flyers are the quality/contract level we are looking at.
- We will be in the mix for players of the Brendan Smith, Christian Fischer, Ryan Lomberg quality level to fill out roles.
- Levi, Johnson and Rousek will be in the NHL in back-up roles
- We will come in 6-7 million below the cap.

 

[TehDoak]

You are right... Skinner can only operate in a certain set of circumstances... that is why since he isn't going to be traded or bought out I am hoping Ruff at least starts out with Skinner Thompson Tuch in hopes that they can reignite the previous years magic. Even tho Peterka looked fantastic up on that line and has seemingly passed Skinner I think Peterka can succeed with Cozens and Quinn.
Throwing Skinner on 3rd like with Krebs or whoever the hell else we get is probably going to turn that line into mush.

Isn't that the opposite though? You have a player who is inflexible and needs special treatment to be successful. You think that is conducive to a winning environment?

You think players who outwork him nightly are happy he'd be getting premium ice time by just showing up because he's paid more?

Skinner is a guy who is going to score a lot of goals for bad teams and won't get the chance on good teams. He may never see a playoff game unless he's willing to work hard in a lessor role.

 

[Mattilaus]

(also @Mattilaus)

Doesn’t this just prove my point? Those mid '00s teams were the best a lot of us have ever seen. Lindy was coach & Max was arguably even more of a liability than Skinner. His presence didn't stop them from contending.


I'd like to think that Lindy will utilise his players to their strengths. It's premature to completely dismiss Skinner being able to work under Ruff - especially when the only alternative is to do something which hurts the team short to medium term.


He's had six 30+ goal seasons - three for us - playing under two different regimes with two different sets of line mates. That is more than 'flashes of success'.

I'm sure that Lindy will eventually tire of him - but it's also very possible that he initially gets a good season or two out of him before that happens. It tends to be the pattern.

I don't actually have so much of an issue with his defensive play so long as he's scoring. It goes back to utilising him accordingly. The problem has oftem been that we haven't had the defensive players (or system) to compliment or insulate him. Every player doesn't need to have the same role or responsibilities on a team.


You make good points - but i don't see his salary next year as a problem. We can go out & get the players we need while being comfortable in terms of the cap. When JJP/Quinn/Benson/Byram etc extensions kick in.... That's when it will become a problem & when an easier to digest buyout makes more sense.

I mean nobody knows. Maybe you are right and Lindy can crack something when it comes to Skinner. Anything can happen. All I am commenting on is his history of "success". Despite being in the league for a long time he has never contributed to a winning team. Could it just be coincidence? Sure, but after this long I think it is perfectly valid to also take the view that it is unlikely to be a coincidence and that he doesn't contribute to winning hockey with his play style. His history of not elevating his team is long at this point.

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

You can't have team accountability and also give Skinner more than 10 minutes a game. The two things are contradictory.

It's not a coincidence that the main issue with this team has been "accountability" since the day he arrived. I think Lindy can make it work if he's good enough of a coach, but Skinner usage will be his #1 challenge.

 

[Dubi Doo]

(also @Mattilaus)

Doesn’t this just prove my point? Those mid '00s teams were the best a lot of us have ever seen. Lindy was coach & Max was arguably even more of a liability than Skinner. His presence didn't stop them from contending.


I'd like to think that Lindy will utilise his players to their strengths. It's premature to completely dismiss Skinner being able to work under Ruff - especially when the only alternative is to do something which hurts the team short to medium term.


He's had six 30+ goal seasons - three for us - playing under two different regimes with two different sets of line mates. That is more than 'flashes of success'.

I'm sure that Lindy will eventually tire of him - but it's also very possible that he initially gets a good season or two out of him before that happens. It tends to be the pattern.

I don't actually have so much of an issue with his defensive play so long as he's scoring. It goes back to utilising him accordingly. The problem has oftem been that we haven't had the defensive players (or system) to compliment or insulate him. Every player doesn't need to have the same role or responsibilities on a team.


You make good points - but i don't see his salary next year as a problem. We can go out & get the players we need while being comfortable in terms of the cap. When JJP/Quinn/Benson/Byram etc extensions kick in.... That's when it will become a problem & when an easier to digest buyout makes more sense.

The issue for me is- Skinner looks like he's losing a step. Max still brought that electric speed and finishing from 05-07. Skinner at 85% speed and agility is probably too much of a detriment to deploy regularly. I personally have enjoyed his time with the Sabres, though.

 

[Chainshot]

The issue for me is- Skinner looks like he's losing a step. Max still brought that electric speed and finishing from 05-07. Skinner at 85% speed and agility is probably too much of a detriment to deploy regularly. I personally have enjoyed his time with the Sabres, though.

Skinner was tracked as one of the slowest players in the league with the NHL EDGE data. Moving him off Thompson's wing opened up the ice for that line, they needed the speed to push teams back and create space behind that fast forward for Thompson to operate in. Skinner was getting no separation. Maybe it's something that lingered. Maybe it's that he's 32 and age erosion to his skills is going to happen if it hasn't already.

 

[Beerz]

Isn't that the opposite though? You have a player who is inflexible and needs special treatment to be successful. You think that is conducive to a winning environment?

You think players who outwork him nightly are happy he'd be getting premium ice time by just showing up because he's paid more?

Skinner is a guy who is going to score a lot of goals for bad teams and won't get the chance on good teams. He may never see a playoff game unless he's willing to work hard in a lessor role.

It's not special treatment... Good coaches put players in position to succeed.

Jeff Skinner had one horrible half season .. the first half of the season he was playing well and only one of the top line producing.

Now I'd love to move on from Skinner because of his salary and fit but the overreactions are getting a bit silly

 

[Chainshot]

Also, Skinner has scored with a guy like Derek Ryan as his center. He doesn't need to be stapled to a top line but his skating does worry me.