OT: Bears & NFL Talk 99 (also 2024 NFL Draft GDT)

Space umpire

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Nov 15, 2018
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I know I’m older than most of you but a guy named Steve Sable used to work for the NFL doing various documentaries on teams and players. In one of them John Madden claimed that Ray Guy (who boomed punts from deep in Raider territory and was a master at hitting the coffin corner) benefited the Raiders about 50 yards a game in field position compared to avera Punter stats.
If this guy is as good as advertised a 4th is probably wha it took. It would have been dumb to trade down and not get your guy.
 
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Space umpire

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Nov 15, 2018
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Cocoa Beach, Florida
It's shaping up to be an extremely weak draft, especially at the QB position.
The Bears won’t be looking at QB’s until the 27 draft.

A major reason we saw 6 QB's go in first 12 in this draft

Bo Nix if he was in next years draft would have been head and shoulders #1 QB
And any of them may 3-5 years from now be considered the best QB from this draft.
 

TLEH

Pronounced T-Lay
Feb 28, 2015
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The whole stadium thing is a going to be an ongoing debacle I think. Building a stadium in Minneapolis vs Chicago is a completely different ball game.
 

Idionym

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Apr 6, 2015
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Expecting anything out of day 3 picks is a fool's errand and never worth getting mad about.

LOL

The mayor of Chicago negotiating on taxpayer funding without city council, county or state officials involved



This thing was well DOA

The Illinois Sports Facilities Authority (which would provide the Bears with the stadium funding they're seeking) also released their estimated numbers, which are way higher than the Bears due to interest rates that the Bears didn't factor in. So the Bears are looking for significantly more money than they initially said, which is obvious to anyone who knows how these projects go.

Brandon being all in favor of this is not going to earn him any goodwill amongst his allies in Springfield, which he is already running dangerously low on (see the vote on the CPS school closure moratorium).
 

TLEH

Pronounced T-Lay
Feb 28, 2015
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Bomoseen, Vermont
The Illinois Sports Facilities Authority (which would provide the Bears with the stadium funding they're seeking) also released their estimated numbers, which are way higher than the Bears due to interest rates that the Bears didn't factor in. So the Bears are looking for significantly more money than they initially said, which is obvious to anyone who knows how these projects go.

Brandon being all in favor of this is not going to earn him any goodwill amongst his allies in Springfield, which he is already running dangerously low on (see the vote on the CPS school closure moratorium).
Aren't most of these muni bond type stadium things usually interest free? I know you're way more knowledgeable.
 

Idionym

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Aren't most of these muni bond type stadium things usually interest free? I know you're way more knowledgeable.
Not sure about other states, but I believe you're thinking of muni bonds being tax-free for those who purchase them. Here's my surely incomplete, oversimplified understanding of this process:

For funding for the stadium itself, the Bears are asking for money from the Illinois Sports Facilities Authority (ISFA). The ISFA bonds out the money, which is then paid back over time using revenue from a 2% hotel tax. We are currently paying back bonds from 2003 and 2014 that were used to finance the Sox stadium with an interest rate somewhere between 5%-9% depending on the bond. The ISFA is currently paying back those bonds, so the Bears plan calls for the refinancing of those bonds, which is where some of that discrepancy is coming from (the Bears didn't include that refinance in their numbers). This is also where the Johnson statement of "no new taxes" for this proposal is coming from. TECHNICALLY, the Bears aren't asking for any new taxes, they merely want to totally monopolize that 2% hotel tax for themselves for a long time. This has caused the Sox and Chicago Red Stars to be upset at the proposal, because the Bears proposal basically takes any other team wanting to use the ISFA money out of the game for decades.

For the funding for the infrastructure improvements, the Bears are much more vague, but it's pretty clear that they'd be asking for most of this money from the state. In 2019, the state passed a capital bill that created a dedicated fund for capital improvements in the state by raising the gas tax. Similarly to ISFA, the state basically sells bonds for various capital projects and uses the revenue from the gas tax to pay those bonds back over time. Like the ISFA, no new taxes are being used to pay for this, it merely takes away hundreds of millions of dollars that could be used for other capital projects to go towards this project. Capital money generally goes towards units of government (municipalities and school districts in particular) for things that must be fixed (I've seen capital money go to schools to fix roofs that would otherwise collapse, for example), so the money going to Bears that would otherwise go to these critical infrastructure repairs would need to be paid for primarily by property taxpayers, so I would argue that the Bears proposal will inevitably raise property taxes.

So the Bears plan essentially calls for the state to bond out billions of dollars for this project. They, however, didn't put out numbers taking into account the fact that these bonds would have interest, which is why the ISFA's numbers are almost double what the Bears are saying the project would cost. Just a total non-start of a proposal from the Bears.
 

TLEH

Pronounced T-Lay
Feb 28, 2015
19,906
15,720
Bomoseen, Vermont
Not sure about other states, but I believe you're thinking of muni bonds being tax-free for those who purchase them. Here's my surely incomplete, oversimplified understanding of this process:

For funding for the stadium itself, the Bears are asking for money from the Illinois Sports Facilities Authority (ISFA). The ISFA bonds out the money, which is then paid back over time using revenue from a 2% hotel tax. We are currently paying back bonds from 2003 and 2014 that were used to finance the Sox stadium with an interest rate somewhere between 5%-9% depending on the bond. The ISFA is currently paying back those bonds, so the Bears plan calls for the refinancing of those bonds, which is where some of that discrepancy is coming from (the Bears didn't include that refinance in their numbers). This is also where the Johnson statement of "no new taxes" for this proposal is coming from. TECHNICALLY, the Bears aren't asking for any new taxes, they merely want to totally monopolize that 2% hotel tax for themselves for a long time. This has caused the Sox and Chicago Red Stars to be upset at the proposal, because the Bears proposal basically takes any other team wanting to use the ISFA money out of the game for decades.

For the funding for the infrastructure improvements, the Bears are much more vague, but it's pretty clear that they'd be asking for most of this money from the state. In 2019, the state passed a capital bill that created a dedicated fund for capital improvements in the state by raising the gas tax. Similarly to ISFA, the state basically sells bonds for various capital projects and uses the revenue from the gas tax to pay those bonds back over time. Like the ISFA, no new taxes are being used to pay for this, it merely takes away hundreds of millions of dollars that could be used for other capital projects to go towards this project. Capital money generally goes towards units of government (municipalities and school districts in particular) for things that must be fixed (I've seen capital money go to schools to fix roofs that would otherwise collapse, for example), so the money going to Bears that would otherwise go to these critical infrastructure repairs would need to be paid for primarily by property taxpayers, so I would argue that the Bears proposal will inevitably raise property taxes.

So the Bears plan essentially calls for the state to bond out billions of dollars for this project. They, however, didn't put out numbers taking into account the fact that these bonds would have interest, which is why the ISFA's numbers are almost double what the Bears are saying the project would cost. Just a total non-start of a proposal from the Bears.
Thanks for the description. Yes I was thinking about tax free not interest free, duh. I was trying to recall what I had learned from a similar situation in Alexandria, VA for the Caps and Wizards, that also got voted down.
 
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dreadpirateroberts

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Nov 14, 2018
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Seven Seas

18. Chicago Bears: Deone Walker, DT, Kentucky​

Every time Walker rushes the passer, it feels like the field is tilted, which allows him to charge downhill and run through road blocks using his 6-6, 350-pound frame. Throw on the tape from the bowl game against Clemson and watch him work.
2025 is setting up to be a really nice class for DT and EDGE. Walker is 6-foot-6 and 348 pounds, and led all FBS interior defensive linemen in pressures (51) this past season. Sounds like he could be the next Dexter Lawrence. If Carolina finishes worst again, they could be looking at either getting another 1st round talent at #33 or trading back into the 1st and selecting an EDGE
 

Praetorian Caps

Registered User
May 15, 2018
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DJ Moore is already working out with Caleb. He is hitting the ground running. I'm sure others will be working together with Williams too. But it is so encouraging to see CW understands he is going to have to invest a lot of work in this transition. A lot of players don't. They assume they have so much talent that they will be great in the NFL, and then they fail/bust. Caleb looks like he's approaching this with the right attitude.

One other thought. With all of this attention being put on Odunzie, it's probably a really good thing for Caleb to give D.J. Moore some respect and love too. That is great leadership by our QB1 here. And for obvious reasons I love DJ's workout shirt. 😆



 

Dr Salt

Bedard saved me
Feb 26, 2019
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ym
A major reason we saw 6 QB's go in first 12 in this draft

Bo Nix if he was in next years draft would have been head and shoulders #1 QB
I'd take Carson Beck over Penix and he's debatable with Nix but its still a weak class next year. Not the kind of QB class you nuke the team for. Weigeman or Nussemier might push their stock up but still weak.
 

Dr Salt

Bedard saved me
Feb 26, 2019
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ym
It's shaping up to be an extremely weak draft, especially at the QB position.
Strongly disagree. The QB class is weak, but the RB, OT, EDGE, DT, and CB classes look very strong. WR class is average for 2020s standards but still very strong in terms of high-end talent. Luther Burden III is probably the consensus WR4 over BTJ easily if he was eligible to declare this year. Very reminiscent of 2022 where the bulk of the talent is in the trenches or defense but will be unfairly declared a weak class because of the QB talent lacking.
 

Kurtosis

GHG
May 26, 2010
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The Village Within the City
Speaking of 2025 draft



I wouldn't want anything to do with him or his father

Compare that with what Williams said when he got drafted (about how everyone down to the custodians matters and wanting to learn all that he could about his teammates). The way you treat others around you says a lot about your character and ability to lead.

This is what constitutes an actual red flag with regards to character, not painting your fingernails.
 
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