Is hockey in Canada dying?

[Machinehead]

All the usual suspects out on their opportunity to bring up "the country is dying."

 

[elmaco]

Canada has the third largest population of any hockey nation after the US and Russia.

The cultural importance of the sport is unmatched in any other nation, including the US.

It will continue to produce high end hockey players for decades.

The current lack of elite Canadian goalies is disappointing.

Have you seen Finland? There's like 100k people packed into one square when they win a world championship lol

 

[SannywithoutCompy]

All the usual suspects out on their opportunity to bring up "the country is dying."

It's objectively not going well here lol.

I don't place blame on anyone coming here for opportunities or looking for a better life, but we don't have the capability to keep up with it and it is having a significant impact.

It's also not racist to suggest that millions of people coming from a place where ice hockey is an afterthought of an afterthought of an afterthought might dilute the popularity of the sport in the country, especially as more kids see their friends playing different sports like cricket or soccer.

It's also extremely expensive to play high level hockey, and much less expensive to play the other aforementioned sports.

People also don't have the resources to put their kids through hockey with the cost of living skyrocketing as a result of the government bringing in millions of people and overwhelming our housing market and job market.

None of this is the fault of the people coming here, and I frankly haven't seen anyone in the thread suggest it is.

 

[sufferer]

This ain’t it

Says who?

 

[Lawzy]

No, but if the trends of the last 10 years continue it will be. You can only price out the demographic who is passionate about it while replacing the dying population with Indians for so long before it catches up to hockey in Canada.

"Low key." Either something is racist or it's not. Just tossing words for the sake of it? "Racist" has lost its meaning thanks to it being used to combat any message the listener disagrees with. Eyes do not lie. When the video of that kid Canucks fan surfaced, showing him cursing out Hyman and Campbell, how many non-Indians could you count? To say the Canucks have a large amount of Indian fans is as about as racist as saying the Oilers have a majority of white fans. It'a just facts.

I think the part he's struggling with is the idea that replacing "traditional" (read: white) hockey fans with Indians will somehow decrease the quality of hockey players coming out of Canada.

It's not just hockey fans that are being replaced. It's hockey players as well. Heck, even 20 years ago when I was playing house in the Lower Mainland there was a noticeable influx of Indian players. We haven't quite seen an A+ prospect of Indian descent yet but they're definitely coming.

 

[Golden_Jet]

All the usual suspects out on their opportunity to bring up "the country is dying."

Ya I don’t listen to dumb uninformed posts like that, looking for clicks, just shows they don’t understand the game or the business side of it.
Probably do well on Reddit though.

 

[buffa dud]

The United States is taking over as the hockey superpower with them churning out players. Canada seems to be falling behind.

If we're doing a basic sense check, I'd be concerned that the NHL's primary source of incoming talent seems to be its retired players. Bertuzzi, Iginla, Tkachuk, the Sutters, Domi, Nylander, Foligno, Bonk, Perreault, etc.

You're a multi-billion dollar entity paying its players millions of dollars, yet the prospects with the best chances for success are the ones who were brought up with the sport at a very young age and have the very best access to trainers, ice-time, facilities, etc. All of those cost a significant amount of money, and at this point in time it's what's going to limit this sport's accessibility to future generations.

I will predict a very gradual shift of parents putting their kids in baseball, basketball, golf and football because the longterm payout is better and the upfront investment is significantly lower. With the W (WNBA) gaining in popularity, basketball is probably going to gain traction like never before because young girls are going to grow up knowing they have an avenue for professional sports. Young boys will follow suit, because the majority of adolescent boys are hormone governed. And in twenty years, the majority of households will be tuning in to either the NBA or W rather than picking up a Center Ice package.

The NHL should be very concerned. I doubt Bettman has sense enough to see a freight train coming, though. Even if he was standing on the tracks.

 

[jigglysquishy]

One thing lost in the immigration discussion is that Canadian born whites are also moving away from the sport. Basketball continues to boom in all demographics here.

The NHL becoming more money based also means that the diversity from incoming Canadian white populations is shrinking. 30 years ago you would get kids of immigrants from all over Europe. The best Canadians in 1990 were not just British. Gretzky, Yzerman, Sakic, Hawerchuk (Esposito and Sawchuk earlier). You had strong French representation in Lemieux, Roy, Bourque. Even western Canadian Messier. Plus the Anglos like Coffey, MacInnis, Oates, Hull.

Now, the top Canadians reads very Anglo. McDavid. Crosby. MacKinnon. Marner. Point. Hyman, Reinhart, and Makar are the only superstar Canadians not from a British background. Bouchard for the western Canadian French. Some comes from Anglicizing names, but a lot of it is that immigrants from 1950 aren't old money yet.

The old money in this country is still primarily of British extract. And as hockey becomes increasingly closed doors financially it manifests in a league without Ukrainian Canadians.

It wasn't that long ago that Stamkos and Tavares broke through from ethnic backgrounds.

And yes, I know Celebrini is an Italian name.

 

[Golden_Jet]

One thing lost in the immigration discussion is that Canadian born whites are also moving away from the sport. Basketball continues to boom in all demographics here.

The NHL becoming more money based also means that the diversity from incoming Canadian white populations is shrinking. 30 years ago you would get kids of immigrants from all over Europe. The best Canadians in 1990 were not just British. Gretzky, Yzerman, Sakic, Hawerchuk (Esposito and Sawchuk earlier). You had strong French representation in Lemieux, Roy, Bourque. Even western Canadian Messier. Plus the Anglos like Coffey, MacInnis, Oates, Hull.

Now, the top Canadians reads very Anglo. McDavid. Crosby. MacKinnon. Marner. Point. Hyman, Reinhart, and Makar are the only superstar Canadians not from a British background. Bouchard for the western Canadian French. Some comes from Anglicizing names, but a lot of it is that immigrants from 1950 aren't old money yet.

The old money in this country is still primarily of British extract. And as hockey becomes increasingly closed doors financially it manifests in a league without Ukrainian Canadians.

It wasn't that long ago that Stamkos and Tavares broke through from ethnic backgrounds.

And yes, I know Celebrini is an Italian name.

Most popular sports by interest in Canada 2023 | Statista

What is the most popular sport in Canada? A survey revealed that hockey was the most popular sport in the North American country in terms of interest.

www.statista.com

Hockey emerges as Canadians’ favourite sport to watch, and the generational responses pose interesting insights for the popularity of Canada’s national sport. - Narrative Research

April 3, 2024 In our latest national survey, we provided … Continue reading "Hockey emerges as Canadians’ favourite sport to watch, and the generational responses pose interesting insights for the popularity of Canada’s national sport."

narrativeresearch.ca

Canada's favourite sport to watch is hockey, survey shows

The 2024 Stanley Cup playoffs have already delivered a fever level of fan excitement in Canada.

www.ctvnews.ca

Among 18-24 year olds

Canadians still favour hockey — but maybe not for long, as basketball and soccer gain popularity

While hockey remains the most popular among 18 to 24 year olds at 21.8 per cent, it's followed closely by basketball, at 17.6 per cent.

nationalpost.com

 

[WarriorofTime]

Stamkos and Tavares were already 3rd generation Canadian, not children of immigrants. I don't think the genealogy test matters so much as the point that recent waves of immigration aren't integrating newly arriving folks into an existing cultural fabric the same as prior ones, with something like hockey being a big marker of that.

 

[jigglysquishy]

Hockey emerges as Canadians’ favourite sport to watch, and the generational responses pose interesting insights for the popularity of Canada’s national sport. - Narrative Research

April 3, 2024 In our latest national survey, we provided … Continue reading "Hockey emerges as Canadians’ favourite sport to watch, and the generational responses pose interesting insights for the popularity of Canada’s national sport."

narrativeresearch.ca

I think this does a good job of showing the age difference for sports popularity.

For over 50s, hockey is king by a wide margin. For under 20s, hockey is neck and neck with basketball.

Stamkos and Tavares were already 3rd generation Canadian, not children of immigrants.

But they weren't Anglos.

Hockey went from Anglo only to very diverse, and is shifting back to Anglo dominant.

Old money.

 

[WarriorofTime]

But they weren't Anglos.

Hockey went from Anglo only to very diverse, and is shifting back to Anglo dominant.

Old money.

Tough to say just with a cursory glance of last names. White Americans and Canadians are very anglo-dominant, maybe even more so in Canada due to the much closer modern links. Then you have anglification of names, then you consider a 4th gen Canadian could have 8 great grandparents that came from various places.

 

[joelef]

Just the death of the monoculture in general also plays into it. I doubt you'd get a modern day OJ Simpson Trial in the U.S. for instance. It's no longer a question of "what's on", there are limitless ways to captivate a person's attention now, so no one space can dominate to the same extent.

Stamkos and Tavares were already 3rd generation Canadian, not children of immigrants. I don't think the genealogy test matters so much as the point that recent waves of immigration aren't integrating newly arriving folks into an existing cultural fabric the same as prior ones, with something like hockey being a big marker of that.

You also have the internet which makes way easier to follow sports teams across the pond. A few years in the middle of Walmart near me there was a South African dude watching South African domestic rugby right in his phone . This was in St. Paul Minnesota

Stamkos and Tavares were already 3rd generation Canadian, not children of immigrants. I don't think the genealogy test matters so much as the point that recent waves of immigration aren't integrating newly arriving folks into an existing cultural fabric the same as prior ones, with something like hockey being a big marker of that.

Also basketball association with hip hop also helps

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

It's not dying but the price of hockey equipment and everything around it has been worse than ever.

Sad that the gouv dont do anything to support hockey in canada in general. playing hockey costs alot compared to any other sports.

 

[tyhee]

Our population has grown by what? 3.5M people in the past few years. All or most are migrants from India. We are a fast changing demographic.

Hockey is NOT a popular sport in India.

Canada's future national sport is soon to be cricket.

Future anthem will be;

Hockey is a very popular game in India, which won a bronze medal in the sport in the 2020 (21) Tokyo Summer Olympics.

On the other hand, when people from India refer to hockey they are not referring to a game played on ice. Perhaps field hockey can become our national sport instead of cricket.

[Of course, your point is well taken. As Canada's fertility rate plummets well below replacement level while the population grows largely through immigration from countries without an ice hockey tradition, the number of Canadians passionate about ice hockey should be expected to decrease, although the number remains high enough that the sport isn't at risk of dying in the near future.]

 

[Minnesota Knudsens]

All the usual suspects out on their opportunity to bring up "the country is dying."

I stopped cooking the steak out of the back of my $50 000 truck with Sea-doo just to say “the country is dying”.

 

[voyageur]

One thing lost in the immigration discussion is that Canadian born whites are also moving away from the sport. Basketball continues to boom in all demographics here.

The NHL becoming more money based also means that the diversity from incoming Canadian white populations is shrinking. 30 years ago you would get kids of immigrants from all over Europe. The best Canadians in 1990 were not just British. Gretzky, Yzerman, Sakic, Hawerchuk (Esposito and Sawchuk earlier). You had strong French representation in Lemieux, Roy, Bourque. Even western Canadian Messier. Plus the Anglos like Coffey, MacInnis, Oates, Hull.

Now, the top Canadians reads very Anglo. McDavid. Crosby. MacKinnon. Marner. Point. Hyman, Reinhart, and Makar are the only superstar Canadians not from a British background. Bouchard for the western Canadian French. Some comes from Anglicizing names, but a lot of it is that immigrants from 1950 aren't old money yet.

The old money in this country is still primarily of British extract. And as hockey becomes increasingly closed doors financially it manifests in a league without Ukrainian Canadians.

It wasn't that long ago that Stamkos and Tavares broke through from ethnic backgrounds.

And yes, I know Celebrini is an Italian name.

I think the biggest change is that hockey was an immigrant's way of becoming Canadian. It really was the method by which any family could integrate into Canada. That has shifted with South Asian immigration, which is attracting hockey fans still, but not so many hockey players. Conversely it still continues in this country that a lot of good indigenous hockey players at the youth level will never get past that point because of the cost barriers, as well as other factors.

Living in Winnipeg and playing a lot of recreational hockey I am confident that there is still a lot of talent coming through the pipeline. It's still our winter sport.

 

[IceManCat]

Is this Twitter??

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

It's not dying it's just becoming a niche sport for the rich like it's been in America for a long time. Is hockey in the US dying?

 

[CokenoPepsi]

Opinion: Canada is falling behind its peers in terms of living standards — can it catch up?

Canada's ongoing economic malaise and decline in living standards are rooted in a constellation of domestic and global challenges.

www.biv.com

Canada’s living standards alarmingly on track to be the lowest in 40 years: study

If per-capita gross domestic product does not recover in 2024, the decline since mid-2019 may be the longest in the last four decades

nationalpost.com

Immigration to Canada surges in April, worsening outlook for housing affordability

Plus, BMO hikes target on the TSX

www.theglobeandmail.com

'Huge increases': Economists sound alarm over impact of Canada population growth on housing market

National Bank says the 2024 trend, which is seeing growth far higher than in the same period last year, is likely to worsen the housing crisis before it gets better.

ca.finance.yahoo.com

National Bank economist: ‘The demographic shock is getting worse in Canada’

Population growth appears to be picking up steam, ahead of government crackdown

www.theglobeandmail.com

Bloomberg - Are you a robot?

Canada’s population hits 41M months after breaking 40M threshold | Globalnews.ca

Nine months after reaching 40 million people, Canada cracked a new threshold on Wednesday, the same day Statistics Canada released a report showing the pace of population growth.

globalnews.ca

1) Things are not ok in Canada

2) We are facing issues very unique to ourselves, we are not simply following global trends.

3) Immigration and absolutely insane rate of population growth is (one of) the direct cause(s) whether you say so or not. It's not a "critique of immigrants" to talk about facts, give it up. It's absolutely true that the country is taking in too many people too quickly right now.

Things are fine in Canada, no more worse off than other G7 nations or other economic downturns we have seen over the decades.

Though immigration is a problem it seems to bring worked on

 

[Andrei79]

who can afford to put their kids in hockey these days?

My son is starting in fall. 1000$ just to set him up. Haven't paid his fees yet. We've gotten him some ice time and a skating coach to get him to speed with the other kids. That's a few hundred bucks more. I also play as an adult and it runs me > 1000$/year for league play/practices too. It's way more expensive than his soccer.

 

[HFpapi]

Things are fine in Canada, no more worse off than other G7 nations or other economic downturns we have seen over the decades.

Though immigration is a problem it seems to bring worked on

Well you're wrong but appreciate your opinion.

Immigration is being worked on you say? 500k new people through the first 4 months of this year.

 

[britdevil]

It costs an arm and a leg to play . Its not a race issue. Has nothing to do with the color of the immigrants skin.

Look at all these first overall and top picks coming out of NA , they all have parents who build rinks for their kids. They also all live in rural areas and have two parents and cars.

Wayne Gretzky did. and so did Connor McDavid.

There's no come up stories in Canadian hockey.

I remember us celebrating Arber Jackeye as an amazing come up story simply because he actually had a job at Costco. The struggle is real when a 18-19-20 year old has to have a job what a brave person he really overcame all the odds!

Bryce Salvador has a truly humbling "come up" story.

Ok, not the highest profile player, but he did become an NHL captain.

 

[Leafs87]

What Canada was 25 years ago and what it is today is not even close. Hockey is just a side effect.

 

[CokenoPepsi]

Well you're wrong but appreciate your opinion.

Immigration is being worked on you say? 500k new people through the first 4 months of this year.

View attachment 873845

Well, I'm not really wrong but ok.

Canada is having a slow down right now sure but nothing to fear monger over, hell it not even close to the troubles of the late 80s/early 90s.