Kitchener Rangers 2023-24 Off-Season Thread (Part 2)

[GeoBlue]

Hopefully some of the NHL owners come to their senses and realize how great Mark and Dale are as hockey minds and grab them before someone else jumps in and signs them.
Hopefully over the summer. Maybe announced at the draft. Ranger fans would hate to see them go but they deserve to move on up like George Jefferson. Fingers crossed in KW.

I can't see them selling the Knights. Unless Dylan is ready to take the reins?

 

[Matttheleaf]

Hopefully some of the NHL owners come to their senses and realize how great Mark and Dale are as hockey minds and grab them before someone else jumps in and signs them.
Hopefully over the summer. Maybe announced at the draft. Ranger fans would hate to see them go but they deserve to move on up like George Jefferson. Fingers crossed in KW.

A few teams are still looking for a coach and I'm sure could make room for a great (hate saying it, but its true) GM while they're at it!

 

[rangersblues]

I know I am posting this on the Rangers thread and it doesn't really fully connect with the Rangers, but it's on topic with the recent talks about the Knights and other OHL aspects but when I was watching the Leafs introduce their new head coach the feed ended and Jeff Marek mentioned (now I am just paraphrasing as I don't have the full segment in front of me) that he believes Dale Hunter was one of the coaches interviewed for the Leafs job. He also mentioned that he doesn't think that Dale would take an NHL job again unless his brother was going to be the GM or until he broke the OHL wins record (which would be at least 4 years away at minimum).

Dale is extremely uncomfortable dealing with the media to the extent that he often sends his assistant coaches out to deal with them even in junior. I doubt he would ever take an NHL job at this point especially in Toronto. He's also going to be 64 years old in July.

That said what Dale and Mark have accomplished in London would easily translate to success in the NHL if they chose.

 

[Matttheleaf]

Dale is extremely uncomfortable dealing with the media to the extent that he often sends his assistant coaches out to deal with them even in junior. I doubt he would ever take an NHL job at this point especially in Toronto. He's also going to be 64 years old in July.

That said what Dale and Mark have accomplished in London would easily translate to success in the NHL if they chose.

I think that what they have going for them is also a major factor as others have mentioned. They own the team (or are at least a major player in the team) so they get to decide almost everything that happens with team. As a result of this they have no reason to move up to the next levels like the AHL or NHL since they have it made here as the top dog. Kitchener lost their best bet at a Dale type in Pete because he wanted bigger and better things at the NHL level and it has worked out great for them.

 

[GeoBlue]

That said what Dale and Mark have accomplished in London would easily translate to success in the NHL if they chose.

Maybe but they did not have any success individually.

 

[superdee]

Mark coached the OHL Knights to Memorial Cup when Dale was in Washington turning the Capitals team around. Mark was also successful in Sarnia as a coach and his input turned Leafs farm system around until Dubas took over and traded it away.

 

[rve24]

Maybe but they did not have any success individually.

Ya I'll agree 1 plus 1 equals 3 with the duo but either could n would stand up just fine on their own and it's played out in short sports previously as posted above.

 

[rve24]

Never never never happening.......but let's say Dale buys the Rangers n the bros go head to head for the next 10 years lol.
The can fight over Dylan, Steadman, Simpson, throw in an ex Ranger or 2 in the coaching biz (and I could see Perry down the road lol) Oh the joy in dreaming.....It would surpass the mid 2000s slugfest.

 

[GeoBlue]

Mark coached the OHL Knights to Memorial Cup when Dale was in Washington turning the Capitals team around. Mark was also successful in Sarnia as a coach and his input turned Leafs farm system around until Dubas took over and traded it away.

Well, that Knights team would be a product of both Hunters. As for Mark's work in Toronto, if he did such a great job, why did he get the walking papers? And I am not sure how Dale "turned around" the Capitals? They finished 4th, 1st and 2nd before Dale came along and then finished 15th the year he coached. I'm not sure if Dale left his mark (no pun intended) after he left Washington but in the years following, they finished 10th, 17th and 9th?

 

[frontsfan67]

Dale is extremely uncomfortable dealing with the media to the extent that he often sends his assistant coaches out to deal with them even in junior. I doubt he would ever take an NHL job at this point especially in Toronto. He's also going to be 64 years old in July.

That said what Dale and Mark have accomplished in London would easily translate to success in the NHL if they chose.

If they wanted a big pay day for a few years to set their family up for life I’m sure they’d jump on that. It’s now or never. Nothing left to prove in junior obviously other than surpassing kilrea

Honestly or since Dale is 64 and has been around hockey his whole life- winning the mem cup and retiring would be one hell of a way to go. Retiring when you’re on top.

Don’t think he’s touching Killers record unless he’s coaching another 5 years putting him to 69 years old

 

[rangersblues]

Maybe but they did not have any success individually.

As a non Leaf fan I was pleased when Toronto chose Dooby Dooby over Hunter (and Lamorello).

 

[EvenSteven]

As a non Leaf fan I was pleased when Toronto chose Dooby Dooby over Hunter (and Lamorello).

That was the big blunder by Shanahan. Lou and Mark would have kept salaries down and the Leafs wouldn’t be in the boat they’re in now.

Dubas’ “We can and we will” crippled the Leafs.

As another non Leaf fan, I’m also pleased!

 

[bobber]

If they wanted a big pay day for a few years to set their family up for life I’m sure they’d jump on that. It’s now or never. Nothing left to prove in junior obviously other than surpassing kilrea

Honestly or since Dale is 64 and has been around hockey his whole life- winning the mem cup and retiring would be one hell of a way to go. Retiring when you’re on top.

Don’t think he’s touching Killers record unless he’s coaching another 5 years putting him to 69 years old

Both Hunters played in the NHL. One would think they were already set for life before buying the Knights. It would have to be an unimaginable offer to get either one to leave the Knights and go back to pro. I doubt it ever happens at their age but I eat crow every day so I could be wrong.

 

[OHL4Life]

That was the big blunder by Shanahan. Lou and Mark would have kept salaries down and the Leafs wouldn’t be in the boat they’re in now.

Dubas’ “We can and we will” crippled the Leafs.

As another non Leaf fan, I’m also pleased!

lou signed the worst contracts, hey gave everyone more years, marleau, zaitzev. he just gave engvall 7 years. he gave ryan clowe monster money. there is a narrative about him that he keeps salars down, but i dont know if there is alot of truth of it in the last 10/15 years. pre-salary cap in nj, for sure he did.

 

[frontsfan67]

Both Hunters played in the NHL. One would think they were already set for life before buying the Knights. It would have to be an unimaginable offer to get either one to leave the Knights and go back to pro. I doubt it ever happens at their age but I eat crow every day so I could be wrong.

I’m sure they wouldn’t mind making more. They have nothing to prove here in junior.

Let’s see if they can lead an nhl team to a cup for an even greater legacies left when it’s all said and done.

 

[EvenSteven]

lou signed the worst contracts, hey gave everyone more years, marleau, zaitzev. he just gave engvall 7 years. he gave ryan clowe monster money. there is a narrative about him that he keeps salars down, but i dont know if there is alot of truth of it in the last 10/15 years. pre-salary cap in nj, for sure he did.

Dubas signing Tavares was one thing. But caving on the Nylander holdout triggered “We can and we will”. Matthews and Marner knew then that Dubas could be had in negotiations.

No way Lou caves to Nylander‘s contract demands. He likely lets him sit out the year in Europe.

 

[OHL4Life]

Dubas signing Tavares was one thing. But caving on the Nylander holdout triggered “We can and we will”. Matthews and Marner knew then that Dubas could be had in negotiations.

No way Lou caves to Nylander‘s contract demands. He likely lets him sit out the year in Europe.

thats a narrative but im not sure its one that we can prove. i dont doubt dubas has no negotiation skills, but look at what lou has done since, lots of bad contracts in ny,

 

[EvenSteven]

thats a narrative but im not sure its one that we can prove. i dont doubt dubas has no negotiation skills, but look at what lou has done since, lots of bad contracts in ny,

I just have a hard time believing that Lou gives in to a holdout who may or may not have earned a long term deal after his first pro contract.

Lou let’s Nylander sit at home until he signs a bridge deal I’m thinking.

But as you said, not something we can prove.

 

[OHL4Life]

I just have a hard time believing that Lou gives in to a holdout who may or may not have earned a long term deal after his first pro contract.

Lou let’s Nylander sit at home until he signs a bridge deal I’m thinking.

But as you said, not something we can prove.

and to be fair you could be completely right as well.

i just look at the bad contracts on toronto and the top ones were signed by lamorrelo, not dubas. marleau and zaitsev vs marner and nylander. at least marner/zaitsev produced to the contract and could be traded for equal value, they had to pay to get rid of the other two.

 

[Coaches Coroner]

Mark coached the OHL Knights to Memorial Cup when Dale was in Washington turning the Capitals team around. Mark was also successful in Sarnia as a coach and his input turned Leafs farm system around until Dubas took over and traded it away.

This is false. Hunter's drafts on the whole were quite bad in Toronto. One of the best minds in junior hockey, but it didn't translate well in his time in Toronto.

As with everything Leafs though, history is rewritten to where they should always do the opposite of whatever they end up doing (even if the opposite choices performed poorly too).

 

[GeoBlue]

thats a narrative but im not sure its one that we can prove. i dont doubt dubas has no negotiation skills, but look at what lou has done since, lots of bad contracts in ny,

Lou is past his expiry date. His heyday was his New Jersey days.

 

[RayzorIsDull]

This is false. Hunter's drafts on the whole were quite bad in Toronto. One of the best minds in junior hockey, but it didn't translate well in his time in Toronto.

As with everything Leafs though, history is rewritten to where they should always do the opposite of whatever they end up doing (even if the opposite choices performed poorly too).

Yes that's patently false. Unless you're giving him credit for Marner and Matthews. After those 2 the 3 best players drafted were Lillegren, Dermot and Grundstrom. That's actually really terrible.

 

[RayzorIsDull]

and to be fair you could be completely right as well.

i just look at the bad contracts on toronto and the top ones were signed by lamorrelo, not dubas. marleau and zaitsev vs marner and nylander. at least marner/zaitsev produced to the contract and could be traded for equal value, they had to pay to get rid of the other two.

Lou hasn't been exactly bashful giving out term.

Anders Lee 7yr 49mil
JGP 6yr 30mil with a ntc a mntc
Nelson 7 yr
Barzal 8 yr
Horvat 7 yr

That's not including Dobson Pulock Pelech. Now NYI is looking for relief.

 

[OHL4Life]

Lou hasn't been exactly bashful giving out term.

Anders Lee 7yr 49mil
JGP 6yr 30mil with a ntc a mntc
Nelson 7 yr
Barzal 8 yr
Horvat 7 yr

That's not including Dobson Pulock Pelech. Now NYI is looking for relief.

thats knida why the narrative on lou being a great negotiator is a bit false i think , it was 100 percent true in new jersey, not so much since. even his last years in jersey he had some big financial misses.

 

[Squirrel88]

Not to pile on, but has Lou signed any contracts post-NJ that weren't too much money and too much term? Zaitsev, Marleau, Matt Martin top the list, but there are more. It's not like this is hindsight either, those signings were all questioned at the time. Add to that Lou's penchant for trading 2nd round picks for replacement level 4th line rental centers combined with Hunter's complete inability to get any value beyond top 10 picks and you get a complete lack of depth and flexibility that the Leafs could have used once the cap went flat. Dubas deserves some of the criticism that he gets, but part of his downfall was failing to clean up the stinking mess that Lou and Hunter left behind.