Proposal: Trades for MacKinnon and Dumba

[Curufinwe]

I agree....but don't agree....lol.

With adding the #2 pick to the lineup next year, we filled a big hole and seem to have nice forward group for next year.

If we add a Dman, that pushes 1, maybe both of AMac and Manning out of the lineup. That should be a BIG boost over last year's team.

Get a goalie who plays well, and all the sudden we could be a playoff team who could pull off an Ottawa.

I still hold out hope Hextall does pull something off but manages to keep all our kids on D in doing so. We need some Vinny/Rinaldo/McGinn/Pronger type of magic trade from him.

It's good in theory but I wonder about the cost of a genuine top 4 dman like Brodin/Dumba or Vatanen, even with the Wild and Ducks probably needing to trade them or lose them to Vegas.

I don't think they'll be cheap. And unless Man or Mac are going back the other way, you might just end up with Hextall putting one less D prospect on the Flyers roster.

 

[BringBackHakstol]

No clue why people want to add salary on prime years of players at the expense of our cheap talent

Terrible ideas

 

[Tripod]

It's good in theory but I wonder about the cost of a genuine top 4 dman like Brodin/Dumba or Vatanen, even with the Wild and Ducks probably needing to trade them or lose them to Vegas.

I don't think they'll be cheap. And unless Man or Mac are going back the other way, you might just end up with Hextall putting one less D prospect on the Flyers roster.

I do agree those guys would cost more than we are likely to want to give up. But I am fine with adding a lesser guy...say in the Gudas level or lower....but better than AMac and Manning.

That's sort of the level of guys I hope we can grab cheap even if it's a 1 year stopgap. I just hate the idea that 1 of those guys are on the roster next year, an likely 1 injury away from both playing in our top 6.

I just hate that we are going to use a protection spot on one of those guys....such a waste.

 

[Curufinwe]

Just think how much we could charge a team who wanted a top 4 RHD like Gudas, though.

 

[NatP4]

I would go Hagg/Morin and the 2nd overall for Mackinnon and the 4th overall. Some of these "scouting reports" on Mackinnon are a bit ridiculous. He's going to be a star.

 

[BrindamoursNose]

No clue why people want to add salary on prime years of players at the expense of our cheap talent

Terrible ideas

If you mean the Mackinnon suggestion, it's because #2 overall could be a bust. That's why. Sure I add salary, but I know what i'm getting when I play this 21 year old center. Nico or Nolan may not be upt o snuff. Never know.

 

[NatP4]

And the year where Mackinnon actually got to play with decent NHL players, he was +20 63 points, 10 points in 7 playoff games as an 18 year old.

Give they guy actual talented players that can keep up with him, and he can be a star.

 

[Rebels57]

I would go Hagg/Morin and the 2nd overall for Mackinnon and the 4th overall. Some of these "scouting reports" on Mackinnon are a bit ridiculous. He's going to be a star.

Yes thats why Colorado is exploring the idea of trading a 21 year old. Because hes going to be a star.

 

[NatP4]

Yes thats why Colorado is exploring the idea of trading a 21 year old. Because hes going to be a star.

Oh boy here we go, let me guess, Konecny is better than him, he's just a figure skater, he wouldn't help the flyers, he belongs in the AHL. You could save yourself a lot of time for actually watching hockey if you cut out the hating on every single post I make.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

I would go Hagg/Morin and the 2nd overall for Mackinnon and the 4th overall.

But Colorado wouldn't.

 

[BrindamoursNose]

Yes thats why Colorado is exploring the idea of trading a 21 year old. Because hes going to be a star.

Colorado is in "We're open to anything anything anything" territory due to how bad they are. I doubt they're chomping at the bit to dump him. They're just not being ridiculous and keeping him no matter what.

 

[The Madrigal]

Mackinnon is so overrated. There have been 9 forwards drafted 1st overall in the last 12 years and of those 9 only have three have failed to have either a 30+ goal or 70+ point season in their first four years in the league. Those three who haven't, Nail Yakupov, Ryan Nugent-Hopkins, and Nathan MacKinnon. A long term deal at a 6.3 million AAV is a bit of a risk along with giving up high end assets for him in my opinion.

 

[The Madrigal]

Colorado is in "We're open to anything anything anything" territory due to how bad they are. I doubt they're chomping at the bit to dump him. They're just not being ridiculous and keeping him no matter what.

If he was all that they wouldn't even be entertaining the idea of trading him.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

If he was all that they wouldn't even be entertaining the idea of trading him.

Yep. Ironclad rule. I'll bet Dallas is really kicking themselves for snagging Seguin for a variety pack of various string cheeses. But hey, Seguin was a 2nd overall pick instead of a 1st, so they can't be compared.

 

[Tripod]

Oh boy here we go, let me guess, Konecny is better than him, he's just a figure skater, he wouldn't help the flyers, he belongs in the AHL. You could save yourself a lot of time for actually watching hockey if you cut out the hating on every single post I make.

In fairness, this is what you said.

I would go Hagg/Morin and the 2nd overall for Mackinnon and the 4th overall. Some of these "scouting reports" on Mackinnon are a bit ridiculous. He's going to be a star.

So you are saying MacK is going to be a star, then offer:

2nd for MacKinnon
Morin/Hagg for 4th

Both parts of those deals heavily favour Philly if MacK is going to be a star.

 

[BrindamoursNose]

If he was all that they wouldn't even be entertaining the idea of trading him.

They could just be terribly managed. Many players have been traded away that became bigger stars.

 

[Cootsfanclub]

Yep. Ironclad rule. I'll bet Dallas is really kicking themselves for snagging Seguin for a variety pack of various string cheeses. But hey, Seguin was a 2nd overall pick instead of a 1st, so they can't be compared.

Seguin was stuck behind two top 30 centers on a cap crunch team. Not all that comparable to a young guy being shopped on a team looking to build.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

Seguin was stuck behind two top 30 centers on a cap crunch team. Not all that comparable to a young guy being shopped on a team looking to build.

Fair, but you're applying context. He also had maturity issues.

The original statement was MacKinnon is overrated because of these other guys who went 1/1 who are better, which is roughly as relevant as what he had for breakfast.

 

[The Madrigal]

Fair, but you're applying context. He also had maturity issues.

The original statement was MacKinnon is overrated because of these other guys who went 1/1 who are better, which is roughly as relevant as what he had for breakfast.

For a guy who complains about people putting words in their mouth you sure don't mind doing it to others. I never said he was overrated because of that. I simply stated a very sobering fact which is that MacKinnon hasn't produced on the same level as 75% of the last 12 forwards to go first overall. You love to speak in circles and dance around the actual facts though so I'm not surprised you would pull some BS like that. If you want a 50 point center locked up long term with a 6.3 million cap hit who you also have to give up high end assets for, good for you.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

Seguin wasn't traded just for salary cap reasons. The biggest issue was Boston just didn't think he was going to get much better than he was & were concerned that his immaturity would keep him from reaching his potential.

Seguin started a 6 year $5.75M deal with Dallas in his first year. He signed the deal a year with Boston the year before the trade. Eriksson was making $4.25M with three years remaining when he got to Boston. They bet on a package of Loui Eriksson, Reilly Smith, & Joe Morrow being better than Seguin. They were wrong. Morrow is still there but pretty much a tweener. Eriksson walked for nothing to sign with Vancouver. Smith was traded to Florida for Kevin Hayes. Rich Peverly went with Seguin to Dallas & Matt Fraser went to Boston but they were basically minor pieces in the deal.

Unsurprisingly three of the worst GM's in the league currently were part of that front office that made that decision. Peter Chiarelli (Edmonton), Jim Benning (Vancouver), & Don Sweeney (Boston).

 

[Tripod]

Seguin wasn't traded just for salary cap reasons. The biggest issue was Boston just didn't think he was going to get much better than he was & were concerned that his immaturity would keep him from reaching his potential.

Seguin started a 6 year $5.75M deal with Dallas in his first year. He signed the deal a year with Boston the year before the trade. Eriksson was making $4.25M with three years remaining when he got to Boston. They bet on a package of Loui Eriksson, Reilly Smith, & Joe Morrow being better than Seguin. They were wrong. Morrow is still there but pretty much a tweener. Eriksson walked for nothing to sign with Vancouver. Smith was traded to Florida for Kevin Hayes. Rich Peverly went with Seguin to Dallas & Matt Fraser went to Boston but they were basically minor pieces in the deal.

I love that there is video evidence of what morons the Bruins Mgt were during that time frame.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

For a guy who complains about people putting words in their mouth you sure don't mind doing it to others. I never said he was overrated because of that. I simply stated a very sobering fact which is that MacKinnon hasn't produced on the same level as 75% of the last 12 forwards to go first overall. You love to speak in circles and dance around the actual facts though so I'm not surprised you would pull some BS like that. If you want a 50 point center locked up long term with a 6.3 million cap hit who you also have to give up high end assets for, good for you.

Mackinnon is so overrated. There have been 9 forwards drafted 1st overall in the last 12 years and of those 9 only have three have failed to have either a 30+ goal or 70+ point season in their first four years in the league. Those three who haven't, Nail Yakupov, Ryan Nugent-Hopkins, and Nathan MacKinnon. A long term deal at a 6.3 million AAV is a bit of a risk along with giving up high end assets for him in my opinion.

MacKinnon is overrated immediately followed by here's what he's done compared to other 1st overalls. Maybe you just don't realize how that reads. Otherwise I don't know how to help you.

 

[tictactoe]

Move Giroux for younger players, picks and prospects.

 

[The Madrigal]

MacKinnon is overrated immediately followed by here's what he's done compared to other 1st overalls. Maybe you just don't realize how that reads. Otherwise I don't know how to help you.

Sure, it reads great if people are going to show enough hubris to make assumptions and try to get inside the mind of others. I don't think he's overrated because of that, I simply know he isn't as productive as the vast majority of former number 1 overall pick forwards in recent years because it's a fact. I think he's overrated because a lot of fans think he is a superstar when in fact his production in four seasons has peaked at 63 points as a rookie and he currently carries a 6.3 million cap hit for 50-55 point production. Carry on with your nonsense though.

 

[bobbythebrain]

Seguin wasn't traded just for salary cap reasons. The biggest issue was Boston just didn't think he was going to get much better than he was & were concerned that his immaturity would keep him from reaching his potential.

Seguin started a 6 year $5.75M deal with Dallas in his first year. He signed the deal a year with Boston the year before the trade. Eriksson was making $4.25M with three years remaining when he got to Boston. They bet on a package of Loui Eriksson, Reilly Smith, & Joe Morrow being better than Seguin. They were wrong. Morrow is still there but pretty much a tweener. Eriksson walked for nothing to sign with Vancouver. Smith was traded to Florida for Kevin Hayes. Rich Peverly went with Seguin to Dallas & Matt Fraser went to Boston but they were basically minor pieces in the deal.

Unsurprisingly three of the worst GM's in the league currently were part of that front office that made that decision. Peter Chiarelli (Edmonton), Jim Benning (Vancouver), & Don Sweeney (Boston).

Ya I don't buy this theory at all. It wasn't a move b/c of stupidity or trying to get something better.

The rumors were rampant. His attitude already cost them one key piece in Horton who refused to re-sign(dodged that bullet in hindsight)

Now I know that rumors are rumors but Chia was grilled on this subject many times. After he left the Bruins his answers became more clear. Basically said there is alot to that trade that people didn't know and there is 2 sides to every story.

They cleared out the bad apple. It was also a big wake up call for Seguin, who also admitted that