What Would You Do With This Team Over the Offseason?

[Blanche Blanche]

SO.... What we need ( Other than a Goalie )

Puck Moving D MEN. REAL Puck moving Dmen.
Jesus.. Watch the Aves and Stars game... The transitions from D to the front for a cycle.
Meanwhile we only had rielly ( Barely) , and he absolutely underperformed this playoffs.

Rielly is a 3rd line forward cosplaying as a Dman. Hes a 3rd pairing guy, with room for 2nd on a good day.
Mccabe and Benoit should be your 3rd and 4th pairing. Not your best.
Same goes to Lily and Boosh.

Teams know the bottom 6 skill is usually a non threat so when the top 6 is on, you can nuetralize them by boxing them to the outside. Sounds like the story for the last 8 years.

They know the D ain't coming in for a threat, only a pass. Sounds f***ing familiar???
Same thing with Mitch on the PP. JFC

Must get better D men to carry up the puck and create a quick threat, and suddenly find outlets for Matthews, Nylander, Domi, Knies, Bert or whoever else is on the top lines next year -- This spreads out the opposing D, and gives lanes for our skilled guys.

If you've ever wondered why 4 highly skilled guys RARELY, ALMOST NEVER see the Middle of the ice by PLayoffs.. This is WHY... Right here.



To Summarize and to laugh at anyone thinking of re running this Crap iteration

We have 45 Mil for 4 Forwards and we didn't score more than 2 goals All playoff series in the last 8 years. I believe the average was like 1.7

 

[alliuk12]

I think Matthews is definitely a franchise centre.

I'm not a die-hard fan or anything, but the guy's won three Rocket Richard trophies and will probably be top five in Hart voting for the third time in his career this year. Objectively speaking, that's a franchise centre. If teams are building around guys like Hughes and Pettersson, I don't see how he's a worse choice.

Seem the team plays better when he’s not in the lineup 37wins 20 losses with him out so i think he’s better being traded

 

[Arthur Morgan]

That wouldnt look good at all across the league. Get benched because your overpaid because your previous GM is a f***in goof. If hes not waiving his not waiving benching him because he wont waive would just look foolish.

I do agree with your suggestion about replacing Shanny and the option to replace Treliving

no because the team needs change and Marner should have played his final game as a Leaf. and okay fine, then if Marner refuses, instead of benching him, just buy him out. cya Mitch

loved him on our team but this can't go on anymore and unfortunately for Marner Nylander and Matthews are already extended so he's the odd man out. although playoffs mitch will make it easy to move on from

he may have success somewhere else in the playoffs but after what 8 or 9 years.... I just dont think hes changing for us

 

[jkutswings]

I'm rooting for a lot of player movement around the league this summer, and I had a crazy idea I wanted to float:

Two teams in opposite conferences are disappointed in their early exits. Among other needs, Toronto is frustrated with the playoff intensity of Marner and perhaps wants a more complete "win now" forward. Meanwhile, LA has some good young pieces developing in contrast to the last of the (still very talented) old guard.

To be clear, I don't see this move happening, if only for PR reasons. But in terms of timelines, would it make sense for a Kings/Leafs trade based around Marner for Kopitar?

Anze has 2 years left at $7M salary ($10M cap hit). Yes, he's old, but in Toronto he'd be the best 2C in the league and actually plays defense as well. And the Kings would get a younger player to add some offense.

It would avoid sending either player within the conference, let alone to a division rival. And while it would open a big hole at center for LA, depending on who they keep this summer, maybe they make a push for Lindholm if he reaches free agency.

Would Toronto be interested? Would LA?

 

[Trapper]

No disrespect to Pronger, but many people have said that over the years- even on this board. It might be true.

It’s been said here repeatedly.
It’s also been said that the sum of the parts, the core, can’t get it done.

This core has shown the same thing for 8 years, yet people still don’t believe. ?????

Time for a change.
Year 1. Ask Marner to waive, start there. Go after some UFAs and a new coach.

Year 2. Tavares off the books.

Two forwards making double digits is plenty.

Just like Toews/Kane, Crosby/Malkin, McD/Draisaitl, keep Matthews/Nylander.

 

[Dekes For Days]

I didn't call him a liar. "We're not going to go into those details" is wide open to interpretation.

More than that was said, that was less open to interpretation.

 

[Gilmour1996]

No coach would do something that idiotic. LOL cmon now.

Who needs accountability anyway? Don't want the gods bitching!

 

[sxvnert]

If Berube ends up with the Devils, expect Keefe to return for another year.

 

[Shanwhatplan]

SO.... What we need ( Other than a Goalie )

Puck Moving D MEN. REAL Puck moving Dmen.
Jesus.. Watch the Aves and Stars game... The transitions from D to the front for a cycle.
Meanwhile we only had rielly ( Barely) , and he absolutely underperformed this playoffs.

Rielly is a 3rd line forward cosplaying as a Dman. Hes a 3rd pairing guy, with room for 2nd on a good day.
Mccabe and Benoit should be your 3rd and 4th pairing. Not your best.
Same goes to Lily and Boosh.

Teams know the bottom 6 skill is usually a non threat so when the top 6 is on, you can nuetralize them by boxing them to the outside. Sounds like the story for the last 8 years.

They know the D ain't coming in for a threat, only a pass. Sounds f***ing familiar???
Same thing with Mitch on the PP. JFC

Must get better D men to carry up the puck and create a quick threat, and suddenly find outlets for Matthews, Nylander, Domi, Knies, Bert or whoever else is on the top lines next year -- This spreads out the opposing D, and gives lanes for our skilled guys.

If you've ever wondered why 4 highly skilled guys RARELY, ALMOST NEVER see the Middle of the ice by PLayoffs.. This is WHY... Right here.



To Summarize and to laugh at anyone thinking of re running this Crap iteration

We have 45 Mil for 4 Forwards and we didn't score more than 2 goals All playoff series in the last 8 years. I believe the average was like 1.7

Great post! I did not read through any of the 13 pages, so if this has already been mentioned, please excuse me. Hopefully Pelley does the right thing, and it wouldn't take a genius to figure this out, is to fire Shanahan! It was his undying belief in this core that got us into the position we are now in. He took it up the ass on the 3 amigoes contract negotiations. giving them EVERYTHING they wanted, and this was after he had made the comment about them "taking a hometown discount"! He is a f***ING idiot!!! So to me, this is where the major change must start!

It is going to be extremely difficult to trade Marner as he holds all the cards, thanks again Shanny! And I just can't see it being a 1 for 1 trade where we get back a top 2 dman, let alone a rhd, one who is a threat from the point, a good puck mover, and is good in his own end. Add onto that we also need another top 4 rhd. At this point I would be happy if we could at least acquire a top 4 rhd and a prospect for him providing we would not have to retain any salary. Then at least we would have some more cap space to address some of the other areas, especially another starting goalie (Sammy is gone and Woll hasn't proven he can stay healthy). I may be way off base, I'm just having a hard time to think of a team willing to pay possibly $12 million for a winger. Granted, he's an allstar (in the regular season), but tends to disappear in the playoffs, especially as the series goes further along.

We need a legit 2C who is effective at both ends of the ice, or at least one who consistently keeps play in the ozone. He also needs to be good on the faceoffs.

I am fine with us resigning Bert and Domi, but I would be hesitant about both term and amount. They are the kind of support players who tend to show up in the playoffs and have that "snot" that Tre was looking for. So if they come back, I like our top 6 with Matthews, Bert, and Domi on one line, and our 2C with Nylander and Knies on the other.

I really like McMann, I only hope he, like Woll, can overcome the injury problems that have plagued him throughout his career. If he can, I think he, Tavares, and Holmberg could be a good 3rd line, providing Tavares would accept that role, and Holmberg continues to improve as well as be capable of playing center.

As for the 4th line, it's a shame that we have Kampf there at the amount he's being paid (did someone say Shanny?). I like Dewar and hope we resign him. That leaves us with Reaves. If somehow we have the cap space to keep him, he would be fine to play, just not full time. Is there someone on the Marlies, a UFA, or someone who comes out of nowhere (fat chance of that happening) who we could either promote or sign for cheap?

But that all brings us back to your points about what we need for dmen. I feel that's too much change to happen this offseason, so as I mentioned, to me, it needs to start with firing Shanahan!

 

[Trapper]

If Berube ends up with the Devils, expect Keefe to return for another year.

I have no problem changing the coach but I don’t think Keefe is as massive a problem as people think. Sometimes it looks like every playoff he has to coach without the core working or scoring. Plus the goaltending everyone is so fond of saying is terrible. Yet he is still hanging on as long as he can.
A new voice sure. Definitely a core change.

People want to see the core with a different coach (again)

I want to see the coach with a different core.

 

[ToneDog]

I have no problem changing the coach but I don’t think Keefe is as massive a problem as people think. Sometimes it looks like every playoff he has to coach without the core working or scoring. Plus the goaltending everyone is so fond of saying is terrible. Yet he is still hanging on as long as he can.
A new voice sure. Definitely a core change.

People want to see the core with a different coach (again)

I want to see the coach with a different core.

Core with a different coach is doable. The other option is never happening.

I'd be willing to run them back with a new coach assuming Mitch refuses to waive his NMC, but unless Mitch shows he can do it in the playoffs next year, there is absolutely no chance I resign him. He walks for nothing and forfeits that 8th year. Good luck finding somebody to pay you big bucks after another disappointing playoff.

 

[Gallagbi]

I didn't call him a liar. "We're not going to go into those details" is wide open to interpretation. Unless you can explain how the NHL policed this, mine is better.

The most logical assumption is that Tre/Shanny deferred to the scouting staff and AGM for BPA.

Not a lot of time to review organizational development, long term needs and then realistic draft prospects in comparison. Especially when we picked a guy in Cowen who was playing his best hockey after the CGY/Tre parting.

They may have agreed but it's unlikely the new GM was instrumental in the pick

 

[hotpaws]

I'm rooting for a lot of player movement around the league this summer, and I had a crazy idea I wanted to float:


To be clear, I don't see this move happening, if only for PR reasons. But in terms of timelines, would it make sense for a Kings/Leafs trade based around Marner for Kopitar?

Anze has 2 years left at $7M salary ($10M cap hit). Yes, he's old, but in Toronto he'd be the best 2C in the league and actually plays defense as well. And the Kings would get a younger player to add some offense.

It would avoid sending either player within the conference, let alone to a division rival. And while it would open a big hole at center for LA, depending on who they keep this summer, maybe they make a push for Lindholm if he reaches free agency.

Would Toronto be interested? Would LA?

i think a deal based around Tavares for Byfield would work better

 

[Fogelhund]

I have no problem changing the coach but I don’t think Keefe is as massive a problem as people think. Sometimes it looks like every playoff he has to coach without the core working or scoring. Plus the goaltending everyone is so fond of saying is terrible. Yet he is still hanging on as long as he can.
A new voice sure. Definitely a core change.

People want to see the core with a different coach (again)

I want to see the coach with a different core.

The challenge being, it's easier to change the coach, than a core. Finding a new coach, isn't a difficult thing to do. Whether they are an upgrade or not, well, that's the gamble. Trading out the core, when they have NMC's, and receiving back value is incredibly difficult... particularly with the contracts that these guys have. Essentially you are likely resigning yourself to a rebuild, or retool at the minimum.... you will certainly go backwards, and likely miss the playoffs for a year or two, which I doubt is something that you could sell to the board.

What we can all agree upon, is that doing nothing, and expecting different results after all of these years, most certainly isn't something we should do.

i think a deal based around Tavares for Byfield would work better

LA would never consider such a thing.

 

[SImpelton]

If Berube ends up with the Devils, expect Keefe to return for another year.

Keeping Keefe wouldn't be the worst thing. How's that song go, "Don't it always seem to go, you don't know what you've got til it's gone!"

Keefe didn't get much out of the stars but he has gotten a lot out of the development pieces. he managed to get the supporting cast to play over their head and make up (to an extent) for the underperformance of the stars.

that's why the series went to game 7. Keefe is the reason that series went to game 7. No small number of NHL coaches would have faltered sooner. that's worth something.

 

[hotpaws]

LA would never consider such a thing.

of course they wouldn't just like we wouldn't consider Marner for Kopitar

 

[SImpelton]

The challenge being, it's easier to change the coach, than a core.

I hate this excuse not because it's wrong, but because it's an excuse. Unfortunately with a new GM in office it's very unlikely that they'll be able to do the hard thing, but it's what needs to happen anwyway.

doing the hard thing is literally what Shannahan gets paid fo.

Replacing the coach isn't progress, it's just motion. Doing something for the sake of doing something. If it makes no hockey sense, don't do it.

 

[janesy12]

1st) Remove Shanahan and Keefe's staff. It doesn't work. Bring in a new President and Coaching staff.

2nd) Approach Tavares and ask him if he'd be willing to go elsewhere. If so, work with him on a destination and trade. He can re-sign back here if he wants after next season at a much lower hit.

3rd) Approach Marner has ask him if he'd be willing to go elsewhere. If so, work with him/his agent on destinations, and a sign & trade. If there's a team that's willing to deal for him extended that'll give him 9 more years on his new team.

4th) Take care of UFA's. I'd like Domi back at around his current cap hit, but for no longer than 3 years..maybe $3.5 x 3 years. Bertuzzi is similar, the money is okay, but a short term. If not, see ya later. Bush has chemistry with Rielly. I wouldn't mind him back at all. Edmunson is great for a 3rd pair, again depending on money. Sammy can move on.

5th) Take care of RFA's. Re-sign Robertson & Lily. Dewar/Gregor I could care less.

6th) Build the rest of the roster.

 

[ANDI P IS CUTE]

Well, that Round 1 exit sucked, to put it mildly.

Here's my wish list:

1. I'm not as down on Keefe as many are, but it's time for a coaching change regardless of his performance.
2. Marner isn't some glaring liability by any stretch, but if we have the opportunity to move him for a fair price, I'd do it at this point.
3. Matthews is fine in the playoffs, he's not the problem.
4. I'm fine with keeping Tavares through until the end of his contract, though I know that's maybe an unpopular opinion. Certainly don't want to resign him unless his price goes waaaaaaaay down, but I don't think a buyout is warranted.
5. Keep Domi, move on from Bertuzzi.
6. Woll is the #1, that's pretty obvious, let Sammy walk.
7. Resign Knies/Dewar/Gregor when their RFA time comes.
8. I don't know if there's a way to get value from Liljgren's contract, a sign and trade or whatever, but would like to see him gone. I had high hopes from him but seems like he's just not figuring it out in Toronto for whatever the reason is.
9. Cya Brodie.

see ya gio.

 

[Niagara Bill]

If you watched the Rangers win last night you must ask yourself. Could our Stars survive in that atmosphere. Could our stars play with that intensity, Could our stars accept the physicality?
I think AM, JT and Willie could. I do not believe Mitchy and Reilly could.
Future players Mintin and Cowan could.
That can tell you what must be done.

 

[Trapper]

Core with a different coach is doable. The other option is never happening.

I'd be willing to run them back with a new coach assuming Mitch refuses to waive his NMC, but unless Mitch shows he can do it in the playoffs next year, there is absolutely no chance I resign him. He walks for nothing and forfeits that 8th year. Good luck finding somebody to pay you big bucks after another disappointing playoff.

I know the reality of what you are saying unfortunately. I can only hope they agree to part ways.

2 things I never want to hear associated with the Maple Leafs again is:
1. Run it back
2. Expected goals.

 

[tom leafers]

Similar to what Florida/Calgary did-

Trade Marner, Rielly and a first to Ottawa for Brady Tkachuk.

just gotta have them waive the NMC's to do it.. lol

 

[sxvnert]

Bert - Matthews - Domi
Knies - <#2C> - Nylander
<#3LW> - <#3C> - Cowan
Dewer - <#4C> - Reaves

 

[Budz]

People penciling in Cowan are dreaming.

I love kid, he’s not ready yet though.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

If I were Treliving I wouldn't make any changes this off-season.

His own personal goal probably isn't to win the cup. It's to keep his job as long as possible. Maybe even hope for getting a promotion.

The team is expected to take a step back next year.

Salary cap concerns are magnified. Key players continue to regress. Why would you waste your '"fire the coach" or "make a major trade" bullet on a year like that.

Especially after your boss just gave them all raises.

Shanahan is coming up on the last year of his own deal. It's only a matter of time before he's let go. Treliving just has to tread water until then.

When things go bad once again, as they inevitably will, Treliving can kick the can upstairs and blame Shanahan for this pathetic excuse of a contender.