GDT: Kitties on break | General hockey discussion I guess

[kerrabria]

Anything hockey/NHL related on your mind to talk about until they're back?

I'll start: how would you rank the league's centers and/or defensemen?

Not ranked within tiers:
Best
McMeme, Barkov, Matthews
Elite
Draisaitl, Stamkos, Crosby, Malkin, Couturier, Bergeron, O'Reilly, MacKinnon, Aho
1C
Tavares, Duchene, Kopitar, Backstrom, Larkin, Kuznetsov, Hintz, Lindholm, Scheifele
1bC
Kadri, Lundell, Karlsson, Norris, Barzal, Trocheck, Giroux, Hertl, Miller

Click to read more...

 

[pantherbot]

How about that Arizona situation? Just a mess there, feel bad for whatever fans they have left. How could they actually seriously consider playing in a unversity sized arena? It's going to screw with the HRR and cap as well, no way we're seeing the cap moving up more than $1M a year for a long time.

They need to find a dedicated owner who can actually fund and run a pro hockey or, and I really hate to say this as a Florida Panther fan, that team needs to be moved...

 

[kerrabria]

How about that Arizona situation? Just a mess there, feel bad for whatever fans they have left. How could they actually seriously consider playing in a unversity sized arena? It's going to screw with the HRR and cap as well, no way we're seeing the cap moving up more than $1M a year for a long time.

They need to find a dedicated owner who can actually fund and run a pro hockey or, and I really hate to say this as a Florida Panther fan, that team needs to be moved...

Check out their organizational contract structure: Arizona Coyotes Salary Cap, Draft Picks, and Player Contracts - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Of the 28 NHLers they have right now, only 7 are under contract into next season. Of the 21 pending free agents, only 6 are RFAs. And of the total 13 players under team control, that includes Crouse, Chyrchun, and Gostisbehere, all of which are likely to be moved for picks and prospects. As it stands right now, they have $32m in cap to fill just to get to the floor. This is a disaster waiting to happen imo.

What free agent in their right mind is gonna sign there? Amateur arena, shitty facilities, brutal travel schedule, team is broke and has a bad reputation for paying bills (including player bonuses and per diems), no shot at the playoffs, and if they sign for more than one year, they could be uprooted across the continent and border to frigid, high tax, francophone Quebec City.

With how few players will be willing to go there, and how much cap they have to give out, I bet we're gonna two or three wild contracts from them. Like Vatrano at $5m x 2y. Or Ryan Strome at $7m x 1y.

Like even if they want to take on terrible contracts for picks, how many of those are even out there anymore? And if the player has any trade protection, you know that Arizona is first on their list.

 

[kerrabria]

I really hate to say this as a Florida Panther fan, that team needs to be moved...

I don't think the Coyotes and Panthers are comparable. The only two things we have in common is that our attendance is shit, and we're 90s sunbelt teams.

They were a relocated team that walked into their new market as a playoff team with an existing fanbase.
We were an expansion team starting from absolute scratch under the old expansion draft rules.

They made the playoffs 8 times in their first 15 seasons.
We made the playoffs 4 times in our first 21 seasons.

They play in a market with a traditional metro area set-up (one giant city surrounded by suburbs).
We play in a weird market with an un-centralized population spread out across a number of counties.

They have never had a halfway decent owner, and no matter how much help they get from the league, nobody really wants to invest in them.
We've had a couple of decent owners, and our current one is honestly among the best in the league.

Their municipal government sees them as a headache more than an asset.
We've received plenty of support from local government (Broward County bailout, Ft. Lauderdale ice den...)

They've never been able to develop, retain, or attract high end players (Shane Doan being the one exception).
We've been a destination franchise for most of our existence.

 

[violaswallet]

Good podcast with Huby! Huby | Agent Provocateur - YouTube

Points: Really need to win one round...if they do that, they think they can win the cup.

The story about his brother is hilarious too

 

[SoupyFIN]

Like even if they want to take on terrible contracts for picks, how many of those are even out there anymore? And if the player has any trade protection, you know that Arizona is first on their list.

Tbh usually the player is aware that he's no longer wanted and he's just happy to go somewhere else, even if it's a hopeless situation like Arizona. You're more likely to get increased minutes there, which could improve your chances of receiving more than league minimum on the next contract, also Coyotes are better equipped to facilitate a salary retention trade down the road where the player goes to a contender as a depth guy. Quickly looking at each team, I tried to pick guys signed through next season:

FORWARDS

MTL, Paul Byron (3.4m caphit vs. 2.8m salary)
VGK, Evgeni Dadonov (6.5m salary isn't great, but if it's a Fleury esque trade why not)
WPG, Bryan Little (if he's done, LTIR)
EDM, Zach Kassian (rebuilding teams always need grit)
VAN, Micheal Ferland (LTIR)
CHI, Brett Connolly
CHI, Tyler Johnson (I wouldn't be surprised if players wanted to distance themselves from the organization)
WSH, Carl Hagelin (is he still alright? point totals don't look that great)
DAL, Jamie Benn (unlikely yes, but if things go sour between him and management? maybe)
PHI, James van Riemsdyk (7m caphit vs. 5m salary)
PHI, Kevin Hayes (3.75m signing bonus due in the offseason, maybe after that)
TOR, Nick Ritchie (need Leafs to retain though, 3.3m due in 2022-23)
FLA, Patrik Hornqvist
CGY, Milan Lucic (5.25m caphit vs. 3.5m salary)
BOS, Chris Wagner (AHL only this season, due 1m next season)

D-MEN

MTL, Shea Weber (if he's done, LTIR)
CAR, Jake Gardiner (if he's done, LTIR)
BOS, John Moore
OTT, Michael Del Zotto

GOALIES

DAL, Ben Bishop (LTIR)
TOR, Petr Mrazek (might be too expensive considering how little they're paying this season for goaltending)
LAK, Jonathan Quick (pay Yotes to buy him out?)
NYI, Semyon Varlamov
MIN, Cam Talbot (can Minnesota fit him under the cap next year?)

Some of these teams are also rebuilding and shouldn't pay to dump contracts, but then again GMs and impatient owners don't work that way (cough cough Flyers).

 

[kerrabria]

Tbh usually the player is aware that he's no longer wanted and he's just happy to go somewhere else, even if it's a hopeless situation like Arizona. You're more likely to get increased minutes there, which could improve your chances of receiving more than league minimum on the next contract, also Coyotes are better equipped to facilitate a salary retention trade down the road where the player goes to a contender as a depth guy. Quickly looking at each team, I tried to pick guys signed through next season:

FORWARDS

MTL, Paul Byron (3.4m caphit vs. 2.8m salary)
VGK, Evgeni Dadonov (6.5m salary isn't great, but if it's a Fleury esque trade why not)
WPG, Bryan Little (if he's done, LTIR)
EDM, Zach Kassian (rebuilding teams always need grit)
VAN, Micheal Ferland (LTIR)
CHI, Brett Connolly
CHI, Tyler Johnson (I wouldn't be surprised if players wanted to distance themselves from the organization)
WSH, Carl Hagelin (is he still alright? point totals don't look that great)
DAL, Jamie Benn (unlikely yes, but if things go sour between him and management? maybe)
PHI, James van Riemsdyk (7m caphit vs. 5m salary)
PHI, Kevin Hayes (3.75m signing bonus due in the offseason, maybe after that)
TOR, Nick Ritchie (need Leafs to retain though, 3.3m due in 2022-23)
FLA, Patrik Hornqvist
CGY, Milan Lucic (5.25m caphit vs. 3.5m salary)
BOS, Chris Wagner (AHL only this season, due 1m next season)

D-MEN

MTL, Shea Weber (if he's done, LTIR)
CAR, Jake Gardiner (if he's done, LTIR)
BOS, John Moore
OTT, Michael Del Zotto

GOALIES

DAL, Ben Bishop (LTIR)
TOR, Petr Mrazek (might be too expensive considering how little they're paying this season for goaltending)
LAK, Jonathan Quick (pay Yotes to buy him out?)
NYI, Semyon Varlamov
MIN, Cam Talbot (can Minnesota fit him under the cap next year?)

Some of these teams are also rebuilding and shouldn't pay to dump contracts, but then again GMs and impatient owners don't work that way (cough cough Flyers).

Almost all of those guys have trade protection though. I really think it's a different beast when you're talking about the Coyotes present situation. It's totally common for players to exercise their right to nix a trade if they don't like the destination.
Here a list of potential cap casualties signed through next season who...

• have a cap hit of at least $2m
• have a base salary equivalent to/lower than their cap hit (i.e., can be traded after the signing bonus or are on the back-end of front loaded contracts)
• have no trade protection
• aren't LTIRetired (can actually be counted against the cap because insurance isn't the one paying for it)

Jakub Voracek
James van Riemsdyk
Tyson Barrie
Marcus Pettersson
Bretty Connolly
J.T. Compher
Brandon Montour
Josh Bailey
Travis Hamonic
Cody Ceci
Joel Armia
Paul Byron
Brock McGinn
Richard Panik
Carl Hagelin

And only the bolded are on teams that will be competitive next year and thus willing to pay to shed cap.

 

[Gentle Man]

Zito during his interview talked about who he looks for.

He doesn't necessarily look for the big name, but he looks for the best fit.

He probably goes after someone we don't know or thought about. Chychrun is probably an elaborate smoke screen. Im like 57% convinced.

 

[Jean Luc Discard]

Zito during his interview talked about who he looks for.

He doesn't necessarily look for the big name, but he looks for the best fit.

He probably goes after someone we don't know or thought about. Chychrun is probably an elaborate smoke screen. Im like 57% convinced.

In other words, Zito is looking for plus fives in chemistry on each line á la EASports.
Chyk is out of our price range. Zito will find someone who is generally considered a bottom pairing dman but who could be a fringe top4 dman (15mins + PK) with the Panthers. Relinquishing a 1st round pick for a pending non-elite UFA dman is a no-go. Sure, ppl will refer to e.g. Savard as an example but the Panthers aren't making their last attempt at the Cup.

 

[ucanthanzalthetruth]

How about that Arizona situation? Just a mess there, feel bad for whatever fans they have left. How could they actually seriously consider playing in a unversity sized arena? It's going to screw with the HRR and cap as well, no way we're seeing the cap moving up more than $1M a year for a long time.

They need to find a dedicated owner who can actually fund and run a pro hockey or, and I really hate to say this as a Florida Panther fan, that team needs to be moved...

I dont get why Bettman didnt fight so hard with the Thrashers. Bad owner and kicked out of their arena and that was it, but somehow Arizona gets 20 chances? RIP Thrashers.

They have what looks like a good GM who is doing a proper tank rebuild but it just feels like their relocated city will get a good team lol.

 

[violaswallet]

I dont get why Bettman didnt fight so hard with the Thrashers. Bad owner and kicked out of their arena and that was it, but somehow Arizona gets 20 chances? RIP Thrashers.

They have what looks like a good GM who is doing a proper tank rebuild but it just feels like their relocated city will get a good team lol.

Big thing was lack of feasible arena: ASG refused to let a team buy Thrashers and stay in arena. BS

 

[Mase]

Check out their organizational contract structure: Arizona Coyotes Salary Cap, Draft Picks, and Player Contracts - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Of the 28 NHLers they have right now, only 7 are under contract into next season. Of the 21 pending free agents, only 6 are RFAs. And of the total 13 players under team control, that includes Crouse, Chyrchun, and Gostisbehere, all of which are likely to be moved for picks and prospects. As it stands right now, they have $32m in cap to fill just to get to the floor. This is a disaster waiting to happen imo.

What free agent in their right mind is gonna sign there? Amateur arena, shitty facilities, brutal travel schedule, team is broke and has a bad reputation for paying bills (including player bonuses and per diems), no shot at the playoffs, and if they sign for more than one year, they could be uprooted across the continent and border to frigid, high tax, francophone Quebec City.

With how few players will be willing to go there, and how much cap they have to give out, I bet we're gonna two or three wild contracts from them. Like Vatrano at $5m x 2y. Or Ryan Strome at $7m x 1y.

Like even if they want to take on terrible contracts for picks, how many of those are even out there anymore? And if the player has any trade protection, you know that Arizona is first on their list.

Shades of The Florida Panthers 2011, and they will have to overpay to get UFA's to sign there. Get your popcorn ready, should be VERY interesting.

If they do end up moving the team, what happens next year, and the year after that, will go a long way towards signaling the start of that move, imo.

 

[Gentle Man]

Aleksander Barkov: The Bashful

This is a terrific read

 

[HockeyRulez]

Huberdeau scores

 

[Gentle Man]

That's the Huby turnover we all love

Fire Bruno

 

[ursavolta]

That's the Huby turnover we all love

Fire Bruno

Legitimately, I thought I was missing out on a game..

...then I realized it was the all star game.

B-B-B-B-BORRING. Hope the kids at the game have fun.

 

[Mogo]

Horrible defense by Bruno's team. No structure

 

[Gentle Man]

Another first round exit by a Panther coach

 

[austropanther]

New Florida connection to the Blackhawks... hopefully a more positive one than the last one...

Blackhawks interview Mellanby for GM job - TSN.ca

 

[Benched]

Next year’s intermission performance can’t be nearly as bad as this one. Right?

 

[Mase]

New Florida connection to the Blackhawks... hopefully a more positive one than the last one...

Blackhawks interview Mellanby for GM job - TSN.ca

Wow. that would be great for him and his family. Good to see.

 

[KW]

I didn’t watch one second of the all star weekend.

I just don’t like the NHL all star concept at all.

 

[Gentle Man]

I didn’t watch one second of the all star weekend.

I just don’t like the NHL all star concept at all.

The only time I ever enjoyed it was when it was north America vs the world.

Cause the guys actually tried. Although idk if that's because of the format or more of the era of players

Draisaitl Barkov Kucherov
Heiskanen - Hedman
Vasy

Vs

Huberdeau McDavid MacKinnon
Fox Makar
Gibson

Who says no to that?

 

[Ghoste]

I watched the 1st two games. The Atlantic team was really trying to win that game. Vasy/Campbell let in too many goals.

I turned it once Huby lost.

-ghoste

 

[Ghoste]

Zito during his interview talked about who he looks for.

He doesn't necessarily look for the big name, but he looks for the best fit.

I’m trying to figure out if by ‘best fit’ he means another good skating, puck moving defenseman that compliments our attacking style and not a defensive defenseman like we all think we really need?

Feels like our PP is slowly getting better. But our PK seems to be getting worse. That will bite us in the playoffs, that needs to get better.

-ghoste