Series Talk: ECF: New York Rangers vs Florida Panthers *Game 1 Wednesday 5/22 @ 8pm ET*

[will1066]

 

[TheDirtyH]

What he does is intriguing. Like I said, it's just, I really don't know what to do with him. There's a lot of guys I don't want him with.

The line doesn't need to score much. I just don't want to feel like there's no chance. Maybe Chytil gives them a spark.

In Kakko's defense, Wennberg is also f***ing terrible at offense. He's Kakko at center.

Kakko's always been a player that needs help 5v5 to generate offense. He's hardly unique that way, especially on this team. What's great about him is that he's found a way to be a consistently positive player for us 5v5 in spite of that. Lafreniere needed how many chances to break out this year? It clicked with him and Panarin. Wish we had two Panarins but we don't: we've got a Mika, who also needs a ton of help to generate offense 5v5, and never moreso than this year.

Contrary to your point, Kakko and Chytil have consistently put up strong GF numbers together the last two seasons. Chytil's numbers improve with Kakko, some seasons more than the reverse.

Our highest scoring line at 5v5 with just a smidge over 60 minutes played was our loaded up trio of 20-93-10. What was our second highest? 50-22-24. So there are players and lines that score with Kakko, and not in spite of him, but in part because of him.

Problem is, throughout his career, Kakko cannot be left in a spot where it's clicking. It always gets blown up. Look what a difference it made to put Laf on that line and leave him there. He had stretches this year where it seemed like he could have 100 great scoring chances and have a line of 0-3-3. He kept improving, he kept gaining confidence and figuring out how to improve his efficiency, and he's had a great 2nd half and postseason.

 

[will1066]

Kakko's always been a player that needs help 5v5 to generate offense. He's hardly unique that way, especially on this team. What's great about him is that he's found a way to be a consistently positive player for us 5v5 in spite of that. Lafreniere needed how many chances to break out this year? It clicked with him and Panarin. Wish we had two Panarins but we don't: we've got a Mika, who also needs a ton of help to generate offense 5v5, and never moreso than this year.

Contrary to your point, Kakko and Chytil have consistently put up strong GF numbers together the last two seasons. Chytil's numbers improve with Kakko, some seasons more than the reverse.

Our highest scoring line at 5v5 with just a smidge over 60 minutes played was our loaded up trio of 20-93-10. What was our second highest? 50-22-24. So there are players and lines that score with Kakko, and not in spite of him, but in part because of him.

Problem is, throughout his career, Kakko cannot be left in a spot where it's clicking. It always gets blown up. Look what a difference it made to put Laf on that line and leave him there. He had stretches this year where it seemed like he could have 100 great scoring chances and have a line of 0-3-3. He kept improving, he kept gaining confidence and figuring out how to improve his efficiency, and he's had a great 2nd half and postseason.

Yep. Laf will likely become a line driver in the future after the current core is gone. Kakko doesn't appear to be a line driver at all. But he mixes well with Chytil and they've always complemented each other. The other thing, and which can't be measured, is Kakko can't get out of his own head.

 

[TheDirtyH]

Yep. Laf will likely become a line driver in the future after the current core is gone. Kakko doesn't appear to be a line driver at all. But he mixes well with Chytil and they've always complemented each other. The other thing, and which can't be measured, is Kakko can't get out of his own head.

I guess that's what's interesting to me... Kakko has the more impressive resume overall of driving lines. I think this year was just tough for a number of reasons. He gets hurt, his most consistent running mate misses the season, and unfortunately, Mika decided from game 1 to turn in the most pathetic regular season of his career. Just the way it crumbles. I think it could've been a very different story is Laviolette had decided the lines to start the year were 20-93-13 and 10-72-24. Not that I care to find out how different.

 

[TheDirtyH]

And I'll just say, I think Kakko's been (aside from Goodrow!!) our most effective bottom six forward. Maybe our only other effective bottom six forward. He may not be scoring, but he's added some edge to his game, finishing hits, defending well, and wearing down opponents. Cuylle is not a scorer, he's a banger. I'm pretty sure Wennberg was victim to some kind of body-switching voodoo orchestrated by Nick Bonino's wife.

 

[HockeyBasedNYC]

Kakko's always been a player that needs help 5v5 to generate offense. He's hardly unique that way, especially on this team. What's great about him is that he's found a way to be a consistently positive player for us 5v5 in spite of that. Lafreniere needed how many chances to break out this year? It clicked with him and Panarin. Wish we had two Panarins but we don't: we've got a Mika, who also needs a ton of help to generate offense 5v5, and never moreso than this year.

Contrary to your point, Kakko and Chytil have consistently put up strong GF numbers together the last two seasons. Chytil's numbers improve with Kakko, some seasons more than the reverse.

Our highest scoring line at 5v5 with just a smidge over 60 minutes played was our loaded up trio of 20-93-10. What was our second highest? 50-22-24. So there are players and lines that score with Kakko, and not in spite of him, but in part because of him.

Problem is, throughout his career, Kakko cannot be left in a spot where it's clicking. It always gets blown up. Look what a difference it made to put Laf on that line and leave him there. He had stretches this year where it seemed like he could have 100 great scoring chances and have a line of 0-3-3. He kept improving, he kept gaining confidence and figuring out how to improve his efficiency, and he's had a great 2nd half and postseason.

I agree with this.

Its kinda sad how he's always tied to a "failed" line. I think a reason he's regressed this year offensively is the absence of Chytil/better playmaking center.

But its really two-fold, on one hand he deserved a longer leash on the top line in my opinion, but on the other he hasn't generated enough consistent finishing/chances to warrant it. He has found a home in a third line role, but as you said, he does need help. Wennberg is a great support player for possession and defense, but not finishing.

He had flashes of his old self with Chytil in game 3 with the cycle work. It definitely puts a charge into his game and gets him thinking about creating and finishing plays with his buddy out there. They've had some really good success when the kid line was together and he was noticeably one of the better forwards throughout that entire year.

Its easy to forget that Kakko had nearly 20 goals last season and another 22 helpers. He can score he just needs to find a line he can thrive on and it stick together for more than 20 games. This is why its such a big deal if Chytil can stay on the ice the rest of the way.

Hopefully it will help Kakko reach his full potential again. He can get a little streaky too. If he and Chytil click and start producing regularly in this series, with the way Igor is playing, you can punch a ticket to the final.

 

[Clark Kellogg]

Up in the Blue Seats Podcast. Mollie Walker, Brian Boyle and HHOF Larry Brooks:

 

[bl02]

Weird since it seems like he played pretty well in that final half of the third period. Didn't look hampered by anything.
If its the "bug" hopefully he's the last of it!

 

[Boris Zubov]

Up in the Blue Seats Podcast. Mollie Walker, Brian Boyle and HHOF Larry Brooks:

I really like Boyle, but hard to take Mollie seriously. She's a total stoner or just a puck bunny.

 

[TheDirtyH]

I really like Boyle, but hard to take Mollie seriously. She's a total stoner or just a puck bunny.

Yeah the whole fawning over Brian bit is exhausting to listen to tbh

 

[CTTribe73]

https://archive.ph/wmdDc

Good stuff. But why does every Igor picture make him look like a starving artist?

The final stat on his playoff GSAx vs Hank is bonkers.

 

[bhamill]

The team won the President's Trophy. Kreider and Mika had moments this season that made me tear my hair out (Mika dropping his stick in OT against the Sharks, wtf was that?) but they were criticized far to harshly imo. It's not like these are guys trying to prove themselves to our fanbase. They have a lifetime of good play on this team to fall back on, and now they are ripping it up in the playoffs again.

Honestly, their EV scoring numbers were VERY open to criticism.
Zibs: 35pts at EV 8.5m cap hit
Kreids: 43pts at EV (not terrible but still not very good) 6.5m cap hit

Pan: 75pts at EV 11.6m cap hit
Trocheck: 52pts at EV 5.6m cap hit
Laf: 51pts at EV 2.3m cap hit

And yes I know K-Z kept the other team from scoring much, but that doesn't mean we can't expect more EV scoring out of them.

If we advance and they keep scoring in the playoffs, that's really all that matters. We are HERE, we have home ice advantage as long as we stay in. You're right: we won the President's Trophy, with them playing as they were. We wouldn't get further home ice advantage if they had scored more and we had won the thing by more points. REALLY, if we win the cup who gives a f***, right? Turned out for the best.

DISCLAIMER: when I say criticism, I don't mean the crazy ass "Tofu Boy" or "they suck" or any of the other wild f***in insults. I simply mean expecting more non power play scoring from that pair.

 

[aufheben]

So that Adam Fox guy…he still alive?

 

[Levitate]

I really like Boyle, but hard to take Mollie seriously. She's a total stoner or just a puck bunny.

man don't say that shit, it's sexist and disrespectful to someone who has been working hard in a profession that's not easy these days and historically treats women in it like shit.

 

[will1066]

So that Adam Fox guy…he still alive?

Very much so

 

[Fitzy]

Kakko is obviously good at some things, otherwise the analytics wouldn't say what they do.

If he just did his thing and didn't score as an individual, I wouldn't even care. My problem with him is that he poisons the line. Nobody scores.

And if he's going to be a 3B/4A, he's probably worth more in a trade than he is on this roster with his qualifying offer.

 

[Boris Zubov]

man don't say that shit, it's sexist and disrespectful to someone who has been working hard in a profession that's not easy these days and historically treats women in it like shit.

Bullshit...if she wants to be taken seriously, she should act like a professional instead of a 17 year old fangirl.

 

[ps241]

Any idea what the D pairings will look like tonight?

 

[Rangers2319]

It's bizarre. Florida is generally the favorite:

View attachment 873894

Yet our series with them is as coin toss as it gets:

View attachment 873895

your second graph is game 1 not series price which is -140

 

[HockeyBasedNYC]

Any idea what the D pairings will look like tonight?

Tomorrow.

Likely

Lindgren-Fox
Miller-Trouba
Gus-Schneider

 

[duhmetreE]

Carolina are the best analytics team in the league. We played them even at 5v5.

And this isn't like one weird model on Twitter, like, you can see it on NaturalStatTrick. We straight up played them even.

If you believe the same metrics, we played Washington even too.

That's how we are. We kind of settle in where our opponents are. I think we do it to conserve energy. Carolina blew multi-goal leads more than once. We blew zero. Our only bad third was in game 5. 2-0 in overtime. We had more legs than they did.

We're content to break even and rely on Igor and special teams. You can't get killed 5v5 and rely on those things. You can certainly break even and rely on those things. Teams have won the Cup doing it.

Obviously, we can elevate when we want to. We just did it.

I'm not saying we're gonna win the Cup because it's hard now, but I was seriously impressed with how we played Carolina.

I still think we should have swept them. Then chytil brought disease.

All year we just find ways to win.

Now we have chytil back… a massive piece to our 5v5 production. We also have Fox who has yet to play to his level. I could easily see Fox have a 10pts series.

 

[Machinehead]

I still think we should have swept them. Then chytil brought disease.

All year we just find ways to win.

Now we have chytil back… a massive piece to our 5v5 production. We also have Fox who has yet to play to his level. I could easily see Fox have a 10pts series.

We really need to get him unstrapped from the Lindenberg.

 

[duhmetreE]

Eh, I see this series going 7 on paper with it being a coin toss. Florida has better top end talent than Carolina.

All of Carolina’s top guys had productive series. Aho had 9pts.

On paper Floridas guys are better. How much more do you think they would produce, comparatively speaking?

 

[TheWrongWay]

your second graph is game 1 not series price which is -140

That makes sense. Thanks. I clearly need to stop googling stuff while I'm home-schooling my 7-year-old. It would probably benefit my kid, too

 

[aufheben]

Very much so

Are we sure? Because Barclay Goodrow has more points than him.